Lisa Ray: I Went Into Menopause At 37, Here’s What Women Learn Too Late

Lisa Ray: I Went Into Menopause At 37, Here’s What Women Learn Too Late

Author Name:The Secret Sauce | Mukul Deora

Youtube Channel Url:https://www.youtube.com/@thesecretsauce_pod

Youtube Video URL:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBuT_HTsKhM



Transcript:
(00:00) You feel like your body isn't your own. You feel like someone else has taken over your body. They know. >> You feel like you're going crazy. Basically, >> you feel like you're going crazy. Nobody's helped you understand that this is normal. >> Perry menopause can last up to 10 years. Your symptoms could begin in your mid-30s.
(00:18) There are over 100 permenopausal symptoms. Itchy ears are a very, very prominent. The eye goes to his ears. One of my weirdest symptoms was vertigo. In the middle of the day, I'd be standing in a sidewalk and I would feel dizzy. I thought like, do I have a brain tumor? I went into chemo induced menopause. At 37, I became a very vocal advocate around cancer, but I kept this secret.
(00:44) I carried it with silence and shame. Women are not being offered all the choices. OBGYn will either say, "It's natural. Just accept it. There's nothing you can do." >> Dismissed. >> Dismissed. gas lit. Women were not legally included into medical research until 1992. Everything was based on male biology.
(01:07) They ask about something like, "Explain HRT or MHT to me." They'll say, "Don't even touch it. It's connected with cancer." But the FDA has actually clawed back this blackbox warning on HRT. The FDA is announcing today that it will remove the misleading blackbox warnings from all HRT products. >> So many women suffered unnecessarily. Ask your doctor, "What is your training in menopause? It's not a disease and you're not broken.
(01:37) " >> Menopause is something nearly every woman will go through, yet it remains widely understood and rarely spoken about openly. Lisa Ray entered menopause at just 37 after chemotherapy. In this conversation, Lisa explores how menopause affects the body, mind, and our relationships. How women can find the right support, and why this stage may not be a decline, but a powerful new beginning when you say menopause or permenopause, what do people misunderstand immediately? >> The first thing that they misunderstand,
(02:08) there's a lot of fear around it. First of all, that seems to be the first reaction. First thing they understand is that it's a disease that somehow women are broken. you know, per menopause. Oh my god, is it really that bad? It's funny because just when I was preparing right now, >> um, >> one of the girls came in and she's much younger and I was discussing it with my makeup artist who's about the same age as me, right? These are the these are the important discussions that happened, you know, and um, >> in a way the most important ones
(02:36) >> and the the most important ones. And she was over here and I was just seeing her eyes get bigger and bigger and at one point she said, "Is it really that bad?" Right. >> And I realized I had to pull it back because I had to say, >> "Look, it's a transitional period." >> Yes. For some women, it's really difficult, right? You feel like your body isn't your own.
(02:56) You feel like someone else has taken over your body. That would be alarming to anybody in the world. You know, >> you feel like you're going crazy. Basically, >> you feel like you're going crazy. And especially if you have no one to talk to or you have no one who's validating what's going on inside you. >> Very isolating >> completely.
(03:12) But um but the point is that it's a transition that is has a big payoff at the end of it and that's you're stepping into wisdom. So like I think that pmenopause and menopause if we can reframe it as a transition and as an invitation for women to actually number one pay attention to their bodies for the possibly for some women the first time in their lives >> because our attention goes to our family and our husbands and our duties and our work and everything except for ourselves.
(03:43) And finally, Perry menopause actually represents that period in a woman's life when you no longer have the option of putting yourself last. >> If you want to get through it, you actually have to prioritize yourself. You have to attend to your body. Your body's talking to you very loudly. >> So, it represents that, right? But it also represents a transitional period where actually we are meant to move into something much greater, you know, where a woman should look at it as I'm walking into my power phase.
(04:12) That's how I see it, you know, and I've given it kind of like maybe you might say cute words for it because, you know, we're living in that age. So, I'm like I'm in my teenager age. >> Uh this is my prime time because in a sense it is. And the reason I do that is because for so long women are told we're irrelevant.
(04:34) And so I think what happens also is uh subconsciously for a woman penopause menopause means that's the start of my decline. And it's not >> not even biologically. Even though there's a lot of weird stuff going on in your body and difficult stuff, it doesn't necessarily have to represent biological decline. >> So these are the first things that I've gotten from, you know, talking to women, having conversations with friends, with other women out in the community, you know, also with like, you know, patients of new her etc. Um, this is some of the
(05:08) feedback that I've been getting, you know, but I think the first thing is understand it's not a disease and you're not broken. >> This is this is something that every single woman on the planet is going to go through. Not every woman is going to become a mother or have children, but every single woman is going to experience menopause.
(05:26) >> 50% of the world's population. >> 50% of the world's population. What are we talking about here? Why are we pathizing it? Why is it seen as a pathology? Either a pathology or as >> it's natural. Just accept it. >> You're done. Now just, you know, did your mother complain? Did your grandmother complain? No.
(05:47) Now, why are you complaining? That's the other problem. That's the other messaging. We're at kind of, I believe, an interesting tipping point in India where certain things are coming out of the closet, you might say. Like we're starting to discuss women's periods. We're starting to discuss of course cancer like the seal has been broken on cancer and mental health to an extent at least the conversation is out there.
(06:09) >> I would dare say mul this is the last frontier. This is the last big taboo >> and it's not so much like it is about what men think as well because we need to partner with men in relationships because you know I mean it's a whole society thing. >> We have some we have some use. we you have some use, right? You can contribute back after all the stuff we've contributed, you know, to the family.
(06:36) But >> the thing is that we have to like now start flipping the conversation in women's minds themselves. >> You know, we have to start with women themselves and examine the conditioning and the conditions that led them to believe that first of all, no matter what happens, don't talk about it. Look, it's personal choice.
(06:57) As we were you were sharing what this friend of yours was discussing at the party is personal choice. I'm not saying or advocating that every single woman has to go out there and you know in a party setting or in an office setting start talking about her menopause or her permenopausal symptoms. >> But we should have safe spaces where women can be heard and not just heard but have some actionable strategy to deal with it.
(07:24) And some pmenopausal symptoms can be very serious, can be almost life-threatening. I'm talking about suicidal ideiation. >> You know, it's happening. My very dear friend um just to give context how I even dropped into all of this. So my very dear friend Sugata Sumal and uh we were on a girl's vacation and I remember walking on the beach and I could just feel something was off.
(07:51) Now, she said to me, "I have to tell you, I just I don't know what's going on with me. You know, I'm impossible to be with these days. I, you know, I don't know. I'm I'm doing the same exercise and I'm gaining weight. I just don't feel like myself. Sometimes I just want to sit in a dark room all the time." >> And I said to her on that beach, I said, "Soon, have you considered it's pmenopause?" And she said, she turned around and she said, "Nobody has ever said that to me.
(08:17) " >> And imagine very worldly. She's a journalist. She's exposed to a lot. >> And she said, "No woman has ever mentioned has ever said the word perry menopause to me." >> And that took me back. The reason why I said that is because I was invited into this world because of my cancer treatments. So basically, I went into chemo induced menopause at 37.
(08:44) >> At 37. Yeah. when you're completely unprepared. And nobody had even mentioned also menopause to me. Probably that was the first time I'd heard the word spoken out loud was when I was sitting with my oncologist and they said, "Okay, we're preparing you for a stem cell transplant and as a result of the high dose of chemo we're giving you.
(09:05) You're going to go into menopause." And it was a lot. >> I didn't quite grasp it. I didn't understand. And obviously the priority was to save my life. So I said, "Okay, doc, whatever you say." The point was that in all of this, I became a very vocal advocate around cancer. But I kept this secret. I took this menopause and tucked it deep inside myself and I never spoke about it.
(09:34) I carried it with silence and shame. me who's so vocal and who's so >> and who already had such a in those days also cancer was also like shameful aish you know like I'm weak you know that everybody of course I have that thing I know that everybody nobody wants to show their deepest vulnerabilities to the world it's a very natural >> it's a natural impulse >> but you did it so bravely with cancer but yet with with menopause >> with menopause not a single word and it wasn't until later on down the road When my friends were starting to hit
(10:08) pmenopause like Sugata and other friends, >> that's when I took the secret out of where it was locked up inside me and started discussing it with friends, with girlfriends, with with women of the same age group, >> right? >> And it gave me a sense of relief as much as it gave them a sense of relief, it gave me such a sense of relief and like I was dropping a great burden.
(10:31) I want to give you another perspective on this that I've thought about and I've researched. So there's something called the grandmother theory, >> right? >> Um and the grand >> I get it, but please say it. I understand. Yeah. >> So as much as absolutely we had these kind of well- definfined roles traditionally, you know, going back millennia, the hunter gatherer and then the nurturer sitting at home taking care of the children and the tribe and all of that.
(10:58) As much as we have that, there's another interesting I'm going to mix this up with a biological fact, right, >> that you know we touched on before, which is that human beings are only one of about five species that experience menopause >> in the animal kingdom, >> right? >> Right. >> And the other four are whales, >> right? >> So if you think about that, nature doesn't make mistakes.
(11:21) Nature is very intentional. Nature is the highest intelligence that we have >> in the universe I believe. Right? >> So why is that? So why are women outliving their utility? >> Mhm. >> If you think about it. So that led actually evolutionists and researchers and scientists to develop the grandmother theory, which is that because a woman still ends up um living perhaps a third of her life in menopause and not procreating that that is a very important period, an evolutionary period that was created where women step into their >> head of the tribe wisdom era. They
(12:02) become the wisdom bearers. they become the ones who can actually advise the tribe, right? And because all of the, you know, those hormones that dictate caregiving, putting others needs ahead of yourself, which is estrogen, because it's gone. Women can actually now see in in a weird way, you get more clarity.
(12:24) >> And I have spoken to many women about this in post because I'm postmenopausal. Right. >> Right. >> There's three stages. There's the permenopause. Menopause is a single day when you haven't had a um >> it's a single day. >> Menopause in and of itself is a single day when you've not had 12 consecutive periods.
(12:40) >> Menopause single day. Then you become postmenopausal. >> So I'm postmenopausal which is a gift. So the idea is that women were given this as a gift and they were always in traditional societies in wisdom societies and you might even see it in you know uh more tribal societies like the native Indians in North America or in South America as well.
(13:04) East India also they have matriarchal >> or East India where you see the women taking their you know place of pride >> and becoming the advisers in the wisdom >> like a senior leadership role in a in the tribe or the whatever the family >> and I was always seeking out the company of older women >> and I would argue that even previous generations were of you know younger women seeking out the mentorship of older women somewhere along the way we've lost that >> we've lost that I think And you know, I would argue like in this present maybe
(13:36) gen Z and even millennials and maybe it's because that wisdom has been supplanted by the digital world, >> you know, but that there's nothing to replace that. There's nothing to replace those beautiful relationships. And I loved older women. Other part of this discussion is the pro-aging movement, which is also again this idea it's all wrapped up in fear.
(14:02) Like what is what is menopause? It's the fear factor. >> Why? Because it represents aging. Why are women so afraid of aging which again is inevitable and natural? >> It's crazy actually when you when when you talk to so many women who are otherwise everything you know confident m but aging is like a >> petrified >> petrified petrified.
(14:28) I mean there's been such a huge push by society to create consumers out of us, right? The more insecure and fearful that women are, >> the more you can sell to them. But what starts to happen as you age is because again the estrogen drops and the people pleasing hormones and chemicals drop. >> You stop caring so much. >> You stop caring so much.
(14:50) So I would actually argue that middle-aged women are the most dangerous creatures on the planet. the most dangerous because you just can't pull a fast one on us anymore. >> We are not easy to manipulate. >> Plus, we carry life experience, >> right? So, we're not 20-year-olds that, you know, you can manipulate into feeling a certain way anymore.
(15:14) >> So, for a woman who because you know, like you said, pmenopause/ menopause cuz it's so silent, >> it's not there and then suddenly it's there in a woman's life. It's they're oblivious to it because nobody told them about it. Their mother didn't tell them. None of their friends spoke about it. Some 40, 50-y old woman.
(15:31) And suddenly she's feeling all these things and suddenly she >> or 35 >> or 35. Exactly. And then she Googles it or some doctor or wherever and this word comes up into her life >> floating around that she's never heard of. >> So for a woman who knows nothing about pmenopause, what are the first signs and symptoms that she should pay attention to? So, I think often um one of the best things that I've heard is simply if you don't feel like yourself.
(15:57) I know that sounds vague, but a woman who's going through it will understand. Okay? Simply not feeling like yourself is legitimate. You know your body, trust your body, and you should be heard. Okay? That's the first one. Now, of course, I believe if I'm not mistaken, look, I'm speaking as a lay person.
(16:18) I'm have no medical background. >> Your own experience. >> Yeah. My experience and my research. Um there are over a hundred pmenopausal symptoms, >> right? >> Potential ones. Now, we've heard of the, you know, the typical ones, the hot flashes, >> uh, joint pain, um, you know, um, a lot of weight gain, especially around the middle area, uh, dry skin, but there's a lot more more that are less obvious or less categorized or less known.
(16:48) Like for instance, >> itchy ears are a very very prominent eye. it goes to his ears. >> Would you like to see one of our experts at Newer? Um, so itchy ears because again there are estrogen receptors in the skin of our ears and then it drops and we find that it becomes itchy. One of my weirdest um symptoms was vertigo.
(17:16) The vertigo was so bad in the middle of the day I'd be standing in a sidewalk and I would feel dizzy like I'm about to fall off a building. I actually started getting really worried. I thought like do I have a brain tumor? Like what's going on? >> Yeah. Because of what you had also. >> Yeah.
(17:32) Because of what I had and you know and I it was never completely resolved until I got deeper into this current obsession into menopause and permenopause and I realized that vertigo is one of the overundred possible symptoms. So the point is your body's changing. Now what is going on in in your body? Right? We have these three hormones estrogen, testosterone, which is very important also for women and progesterone.
(17:56) >> Now what's happening is they're starting to fluctuate, right? They're going up and down. What we don't realize is that estrogen, we think of estrogen is like the sex hormone, right? It's, you know, it's controlling reproduction and, you know, and all the things like that. But there are estrogen receptors everywhere in our body. Everywhere.
(18:18) Like this has blown my mind finding this out. What that means is that you know when there's low estrogen and your estrogen receptors are looking for commands, >> then they're going to start freaking out because like I said, the commander is awol. The commander is not in the room anymore. >> Estrogen is the commander.
(18:37) Estrogen is the hormone that's commanding all of these functions in our body, right? So, there's estrogen receptors on our heart. For our hearts to work properly, we need estrogen, right? There's estrogen receptors obviously like in our libido uh that controls our libido. There's estrogen receptors everywhere in our body.
(19:03) So when they're fluctuating, we just get these crazy reactions. Brain fog. >> Big one, right? Brain fog is a big one. >> Big one. >> And again, you know, if you don't know what to look for, if nobody's helped you understand that this is normal, normal what you're going through, you can start feeling like I'm going crazy. >> So it's it's like what you're saying is be in touch with your body and usually you'll have more than one of these hundred symptoms.
(19:29) You'll have a few things happening. >> You'll have a few things happening. Tune into your body >> if you have. And the other thing I would really highly recommend is symptom tracking. >> Like just write it down for yourself, you know, so that you understand. And you can write down I'm just not feeling like myself. I had a panic attack.
(19:46) I've never had a panic attack before, you know. Um I'm just not losing the weight. I'm doing exactly what I've always been doing and eating well and I'm gaining weight. You know, write down 2, three, four symptoms. Go see an OB/GYN. Who is menopause forward and menopause trained, >> right? We have to remind women of one thing.
(20:09) So, interesting fact, Indian women statistically experience menopause uh younger than our western counterparts. So, western counterparts around 51 52. Indian women statistically around 48, >> right? 48, 47, something like that. >> That's menopause. >> That's menopause. So that's that single day when your periods have stopped for 12 months.
(20:33) But pmenopause can last up to 10 years. >> Wow. >> A decade. So your symptoms, let's do the math. Your symptoms could begin in your mid30s. >> Wow. >> Right. >> Wow. That's crazy. >> Women have to be aware of that. >> You know, >> 10 years. Wow. >> It could be 10 years. And that is information that husbands need to know as well.
(20:55) Yeah, >> that is for everybody out there, >> you know, and >> so >> all of these, you know, so-called and and remember again, there's so many components. There's physical symptoms, there's also psychological, emotional symptoms, there's so many components to the symptoms. Now what I also like to think and I have been reading about this and talking to some people about this is that also a woman's resilience and tolerance just generally takes a dip.
(21:26) >> So look, so you see it in >> that's a good word. You know, I was looking for that word tolerance. Your skin becomes thinner. >> You become thinner skinned. >> Yes. >> To everything. >> The same joke that your husband cracked is now the hell is wrong with you? And it's okay. >> This sounds personal. Yeah. But yeah, but yeah, exactly.
(21:46) Your thin skin. >> That's the Mafia movie. >> You're good. I love I love it that you're sharing also what you know a little bit of what you're going through personally because we need again men to understand >> and again it's because of the it's because of the drop in hormones >> that behavior-wise what happens is that a woman who was like superwoman, right? We we we create these great names that become cages for us as women, right? Superwoman.
(22:17) I look at me, I can juggle my work, I can juggle my family, I got my social life, I'm looking fabulous, my home looks fabulous, right? Like all of that stuff that we are encouraged to do. So from Superwoman, >> she's just now she just doesn't have the same energy and resilience. >> And so she also feels guilty about that. >> She's like, "What the hell happened to me? Why can't I like do everything that I could do before?" I when I think about that thing cuz I spoke to a few women before this thing >> and the image that really captured it
(22:47) for me was like you think >> of the widow in a white sari menopause means chalo this is it >> relegated sit in a corner now and you know >> make chapati and make chapati >> don't make chapati >> yeah and all and she's she's just watching the rest of life play out and she can't participate right >> so do you think I look like a woman in a white sari >> I don't know if you can make chapati but yeah >> not perfectly round ones.
(23:12) >> But I I'm telling you that what we're do and you're right and I'm so glad you brought that up >> because what we have to do as women is we have to sit and look at our own perceptions. >> That's the start. That's the start. >> That's the start with understanding what's going on in our body, but also look at like why am I fearing this? Why do I have like a you know big obstacle about embracing this next phase of life? Why do I believe that this cannot be a great thing? Then you realize that it's all the shackles of of social of
(23:41) everything. It's like you it's your personal breakthrough. >> Yeah. >> That you've been waiting for >> or you have to realize that you've been waiting like anything in life, you know. >> It's like anything in life, but we have to do a lot of like >> you know pulling out the conditioning and like it's work. I'm sorry.
(23:57) I'm sorry ladies. It's work but it's worthwhile work. You know why? Cuz you're not doing for someone else. You're doing it for yourself >> and for your own evolution, right? For some women, what what happens in pmenopause if you look at it is that all the things that were suppressed or put aside, >> not dealt with, >> they come to the surface.
(24:24) >> That is my theory >> of why pmenopause is difficult. >> I see that. >> Right. >> Yes. >> And little resentments. >> Yes. Like say you've had to sacrifice a lot for your family, for your husband's career, for whatever for whatever reasons and then you reach this phase of life and you lose your tolerance hormone.
(24:48) >> These thoughts actually come to the surface >> cuz you've just been suppressing them and now they're out. The genie is out of the bottle and you're like, damn, what the hell have I been doing? Like a bullet of knowledge that comes into your head almost there. That's what you're saying. like, damn, >> this is the reality that I have been blind to.
(25:06) >> Y >> because I'm not in pleasing mode all the time or whatever it is. >> Yeah, >> I'm not happy about this reality. I'm resentful about it. But now, what's the next step? >> That's the important one. What's the next step? That's the key. >> That's like the hidden key that is suddenly revealed to you, >> right? Actually, did you know Mul because I've uh read a couple of books on this that a woman's brain rewires in menopause.
(25:34) This is based on a book and research done by Dr. Lisa Muski called the menopause brain rewires in such a way a neuroscientist >> where a woman can become in fact a kick-ass entrepreneur in menopause because her clarity, focus, everything is so sharp. We don't put that message out there. >> But there are women who are and you'll find them on social media and various things like that who are starting businesses in their 50s are doing amazing >> and are trying to put the message out there.
(26:05) >> My mother became she started learning bridge after we went to college and she got better and better and then she became a bridge champion. She's one of the best bridge players in the world. >> Are you serious? Amazing. And and and this is the thing you know that that hobby that you've been suppressing that you know I always wanted I always wanted >> this is your chance >> this is your chance menopause is an opportunity >> to step into that.
(26:29) So pmenopause as I said that's my theory and not just mine but there's some other people out there who are floating this theory that that's why p menopause is so difficult for women because it brings up what is hidden >> but that makes it an opportunity as well if we can reframe it if women get support >> if they can find community and if they get the right as I said support physical support also through the transition >> right >> you know I just like that thing that you're talking about before and maybe we can dwell a little bit more on that
(26:59) which is that maybe everyone who's watching this which is men and women >> Yeah. >> can you know spend a minute like a second if they want >> and just think what does menopause or permenopause mean? What does it conjure up? What image >> I want to do. Should we do that right now? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay.
(27:15) Okay. I'm really going to like just H >> what came up? >> You want to go first? >> I mean I I could only see somehow my wife and a guy. >> So yeah >> and I was like that's that's not good. Find something else. But I was like,
(27:58) "No, that is what it is because >> that is my experience of it. What else am I going to see?" >> Yeah, sure. So, I saw something really interesting and it's something that I think I've absorbed recently off of like a image that I saw. So, I actually saw a line of women and I assume it's kind of like my lineage, my feminine lineage, you know, all the grandmothers and great-grandmothers who came before me and they were standing in a line >> and I swear I'm getting like slight goosebumps. They were like handing
(28:35) packages, >> right, >> from one to the other. And I saw my grandmother, but they passed a package to her and she did. She she hesitated and then she gave the package to my mother and then my mother kind of handed it to me and then I saw my daughters and I dropped it. I did not give them this package. And for me that represents like I'm going to get emotional actually.
(29:03) It's like you know generational shame and trauma right >> and it's really like it it was very vivid actually. That's just what >> you know >> that's what came up. That's what came up. >> Why do you think you dropped it? >> Because it ends here. I'm not passing it on and I am changing things. >> Sitting here with you talking about this. We're changing things.
(29:23) >> We're we're putting ripples out in the in in the package. Emotional. The package was shame. >> Package was shame. >> The package was shame. And within that, there's shame around menopause. There's shame around probably a woman's sexuality. There's shame about everything that a woman has to deal with that a woman isn't good enough.
(29:41) So I'm curious about like my kids generation because I'm going to ensure that they are not you know as I said it stops with me that's not going to be passed on that conditioning here's my thing mul it's all about choices for women you know again when it comes to something like this this topic like p menopause it's not about like do you need to talk about it openly or not >> but you should be aware of your choices And you should be in touch with someone who can offer you the correct choices of what to do. You know, whether it's HRT,
(30:18) which is another touchy subject, >> whether it's, you know, deciding not to go on HRT or or now they call it MH um MHT, which is menopausal hormone therapy. whether you know what I mean you need to change your diet whether you know whatever other you know strategies that you need a woman needs to know what all of her choices are and my big contention with what's going on from what I see in India and what I hear firsthand is women are not being offered all the choices they'll go to their OBGYn and their OBGYn this is commonly heard and it shocks me
(30:58) will either say it's natural just accept it >> right >> just accept it it's natural or they will be told you know if they ask about something like explain HRT or MHT to me you know what is this hormone therapy that people are talking about they'll say don't even touch it it's connected with cancer I don't advise it they take this very paternalistic attitude whether it's a man or a woman of like I know best >> don't question me >> now this is difficult to unpack because it goes goes into the heart of like how we also see our medical system in India
(31:33) >> and I'm speaking as someone who's been through the grinder in the medical system. >> So I often feel maybe life prepared me for this moment to be talking about menopause and addressing the medical system and the flaws and the failures in the medical system because I saw it firsthand when I was dealing with cancer, right? I saw it firsthand that if I had just gone with the very first doctor who diagnosed me with cancer, I may not have been here today.
(32:01) >> He didn't care whether I lived or died. >> He gave me statistics. He says, "You have 5 years to live." So my point is, having gone through the medical system and as I said, I didn't go with the first doctor who diagnosed me. I found a doctor who cared about me, who sat me down and said, "We're going to fight this. I promise you.
(32:20) " And that just hearing that obviously changed my entire attitude towards my treatment. So women need that too when you're dealing with menopause. Not like just accepted your life is over. The implication in just accepted is like there's nothing you can do. >> Dismissed. >> Dismissed. Gas llit. Forget about it. HRT is bad for you.
(32:39) D >> I wanted to ask you exactly that because I know that you know like you said I I did some research and a lot of uh gynecologists are not you know experts in HRT. >> Yeah. >> So beyond their thing and then of course there's a higher chance that you'll get dismissed or they'll treat it as cancerous which we'll talk about as well.
(32:57) >> Um >> what should a woman look for and how should they prepare for this? Well, it it definitely goes back to what we were talking about, which is I believe at least some amount of empathy is important. You know, maybe from that point of view, I this might be controversial, but I believe a woman dealing with Perry menopause should find a female doctor >> because how would they know otherwise? They just won't know as much as as as as a as a male doctor would have the expertise.
(33:30) And I don't want to dismiss them wholeheartedly, but if you're confused and you're trying to figure it out, find a female doctor with a certain level of empathy. >> Um, look at look at their qualifications. >> You know what we forget is it's a medical industry. We're not just patients, we're clients, >> right? >> The doctor is there to serve us.
(33:51) And I think we forget that. So you can >> especially in India >> especially in India where we just treat our doctors like they're demiggods you know >> and I have a lot of respect for the profession it's one of the reasons why I'm here today but I'm also one of the reasons why I'm here today because I became an empowered patient right >> and so you are allowed to ask your doctor what is your training in menopause you should be looking for a menopause forward doctor because in the traditional training even an OBGYn is
(34:23) not getting sufficient amount of menopause training. There's another special qualification that a doctor can get. You know, what is your interest in menopause? >> What extra training have you done? Are you up to date with the newest science? Because it changes like everything and it's changing.
(34:39) You're allowed to have that conversation with your doctor. Look, if your doctor is defensive, I'm sorry. Also, I feel that ask your doctor about HRT or MHT because that will be either a green flag or a red flag. >> Like a litmus test. >> That's a litmus test. So, it's not about advocating for this. Please don't get me wrong.
(35:02) I'm not saying every woman should go on HRT or MHT. Uh never self diagnose at all in this. But the fact is that the science around MHT has changed dramatically with bioididentical hormones. So much so that the FDA has actually clawed back this blackbox warning on HRT last year in 2025. It was almost like a landmark case because the initial study that created um a connection between cancer and HRT or MHT has been debunked.
(35:39) >> It was shown to be faulty. It was shown it was a different form of HRT that was used in that study and you know the uh profile of women who were used were all in their 60s. So >> right >> it was debunked on so many levels. So the fact is that we were fed headlines for years >> all over the world >> '9s.
(36:02) This was since 2000 I think 2001 or 2002 almost 25 years >> almost 25 years >> the whole world believed because of FDA a study by the >> a study not by the FDA it was a women's health initiative got it >> uh women's health initiative or women's health institute in America a body in America did this study and off on the basis of the results of that study headlines all over the world for the last 25 years >> HRT causes cancer >> yes that turned out to be false or misleading and let's misleading.
(36:30) >> Yeah. And you told me that and I and I Googled it and I saw that the the head of the FDA actually apologized and said that this is is wrong and they removed that which is such a massive thing. >> It's a massive thing. He apologized to women because he understood as well on the basis also of a lot of like female physicians advocating and offering research to the contrary.
(36:54) He understood that so many women suffered unnecessarily that they could have prevented bone loss that they could have prevented maybe a heart attack that they could have you know had a lot of relief during their permenopausal from permenopausal symptoms if they had been prescribed HRT and now the problem the reason I'm bringing this up is that this information doesn't seem to have penetrated mainstream >> uh the mainstream medical industry in India you know like OBGYNS are not up to date with this information
(37:23) >> and It happened last year and I understand I listen I have full empathy for doctors and the profession. I have a lot of respect for the profession. I know it's hard to keep up to date. I know it's hard like you know like they're they're overworked. However, if you are dealing with women's health, it is your duty.
(37:42) >> Yeah. And so my point is if you drop this question on the table with a doctor and if they just wholeheartedly dismiss it, they probably are not up to date. They will not be able to advise you on the most upto-date medical science and what is and what are your legitimate choices because look there are very important contraindictions for uh HRT.
(38:08) If you're a breast cancer survivor, probably if you have endometriosis, you can't go on HRT. But the doctor will advise you on that. >> They should know about all these things. >> They should know about all these things. And even when you're submitting to a blood test, now here's what here's the complicated part about pmenopause that I have discovered.
(38:28) Now, as we said, your um >> basically your hormones are doing parkour or you know, they're on a roller coaster inside. So a blood test while it's really important and essential when you're sitting down with either your endo endocrinologist who's your hormone expert or your OB/GYN blood test is essential right blood test will not be an accurate depiction of where you are in per menopause because they might have caught you when your hormones are stable right it won't tell you the full story right which is why as women we have to be believed that's why symptom tracking
(39:00) is so essential you're because it's very often that a woman will go in and she's got 20 symptoms but the blood test says >> you're normal and then the doctor says but I don't see anything wrong with you right >> so women we have to advocate we have to we have no choice we have to get cheeky >> we have to become our own advocates we have to push back and you have to be able to interview your doctor >> as I said the science has moved ahead with hormonal health women's hormonal health to a point where It's shown that
(39:33) it's not just shouldn't be an option. It's essential to protecting women's bones and heart health and possibly even will protect you against dementia as a woman gets older. The science is out there, >> right? But anyways, I I go on and on about this. I get very like hot under the collar because women have been massively massively underserved when it comes to this.
(39:58) Now, something else that we discussed before, what is the reason for this? Why is it that you know heart disease is so well why is it that male pattern balding gets more medical research than an entire umbrella under women's health research? >> Well, if we look at some of the history and I'm I am a bit of a history buff and I am obviously a bit of a nerd about these things but women's were not included in medical research and we're using the United States since it's the gold standard.
(40:31) That's where the majority of medical research takes place. Women were not legally included >> into medical research until 1992. >> Really? >> Which is shocking. >> Wow. >> Which means up until then, the majority of medical research was based on males biology as well as dosaging everything was based on male biology. >> That's great. >> So women, we don't even know.
(40:58) And do you know why women were not included? >> No, I can't. Yeah, I can't imagine. >> Because of our hormones. >> Oh, because >> because we're not objective. We're not we're inconsistent. So, this should be a stark reminder of why women have been underserved by the medical research community, right? They just don't know.
(41:20) We don't understand women's. We're just discovering women's biology. Yes. And up until recently, I also looked up a statistic of how much globally is spent uh on you know medical research and out of that women's health which is an umbrella. It's not just menopause obviously it's also everything to do with women's health and endometriosis and PCOS that was renamed recently.
(41:41) I don't remember what it was renamed to but anyways >> out of the total global spending 5% goes to women's health. >> Wow. 50% of the population. >> That is crazy. I >> definitely more I would wager is spent on erectile dysfunction. >> Big big market. Uh especially online. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Small pose. Uh this is the part where I'm supposed to ask you to subscribe, but honestly, only do it if you want more conversations that actually make you think.
(42:15) That's the whole point of the secret sauce. All right, back to it. But I just want to ask you a little bit more about the doctor thing. >> Yeah. >> What because that's a good question and I think a lot of people ask what doctor should you go to because you can go to an endocrinologist, you can go to a gynec, you can go to is there a menopause specialist? >> You know it's it's right now kind of a evolving landscape I would say.
(42:41) Um I don't I know that first of all I do know for a fact that there's not enough menopause specialists in India today. I don't know anyone offhand that calls himself a menopause specialist as a as a doctor. There are OBGYNS and some of them might specialize in menopause and I think that that is growing and evolving.
(43:00) That's an evolving landscape >> and I have no doubt there are excellent excellent clinicians out there who care about women's hormonal health >> but it's it's it's a hard landscape right now in India. I'll share what we do at new her you know because that was the reason the the resetra of you her is this >> because even though I'm very passionate about talking about menopause and you know changing the narrative what's the next step women need action >> what's the next step >> what's the next step and new her was kind of created just because of that so
(43:34) a patient at new her first consults with our endocrinologist who is a hormone expert right who will ask you all the questions give you the appropriate ate blood work, you know, because sometimes, to be honest, some >> permenopausal symptoms can also mimic thyroid symptoms, low thyroid. So, we have to be careful about these things, right? That's where the blood work gets in.
(43:57) >> So, you got to get in there. Dr. Rena, she's excellent. She's my personal endocrinologist, and I'm not even I'm not sitting here advocating. I'm not that I'm not a salesperson, but she's just excellent because she has all those qualities. She's a woman. >> She's empathetic. She really cares about her patients and she's great at what she does.
(44:16) So, uh, Dr. is the first touch point. Then on the basis of that consult, she will refer the patient to one of our OB/GYNs. We have a nutritionist that specializes in midlife health. We have counselors. We are bringing in more and more into our ecosystem because that's the thing, it affects everything.
(44:36) It's not a one-stop shop. And even though we are um and we are uh very you know open to HRT and HRT is one of the one of the tools in our toolbox. Let me say one other thing. It's not a one-stop solution. >> While HRT can revolutionize things for some women it did. It revolutionized my sleep the very first time I took a progesterone pill at night.
(45:02) That's just me. I still have to go to the gym. I still have to lift weights and I lift heavier than I ever have before in my life. I never lifted this heavy in my 20s. >> I still have to like look at what I eat. >> If I eat crap for one week, I'll see it and I'll feel it >> and I, you know, protein first and all of that nonsense.
(45:22) >> Everything is holistic. >> Everything is holistic. I have to go I'm going on a detox. I have to do that. My body's craving it and crying out for it after working a lot. I need my sleep. I am a sleep Nazi. So I shared sort of what happened uh what happens at new her I'll tell you another interesting part of the discussion is how invisible women of my age become in the media >> you know I still work right I still I I do a lot of public speaking and now the topic has of course shifted to women's hormonal health and I love that but I'm
(45:56) getting approached by brands maybe because I've been so vocal about being a midlifeer and owning this period of my life like I'm not trying to pretend pretend I'm 25. I'm not trying to look like I'm 25. I'm owning this version of myself at 54, you know. And it's interesting because some brands have approached me because of that.
(46:16) The fact is that I think Indian brands have to wake up to the fact of like who is your consumer, right? >> Midlife women. And if you look at so many fashion brands, like there's an explosion of fashion brands, there's an explosion of beauty uh brands in India and they're all really like stepping up because here's what I know.
(46:37) Midlife women have the money, they have the means, they have the taste, >> they have the time, they've earned their place in society to dress a certain way, to make tasteful choices, to do all of that stuff. But where are midlife women in media? Where are they in the ads? Where are they? Like I would like to see more women of my age >> wearing couture and high fashion.
(47:05) And you know, at the end of the day, those are your consumers. >> That's a good point. >> You don't have a you don't have a market without midlife women, especially luxury brands. >> But we're not represented. And then I noticed a little shift where I've been approached by some brands do some really interesting >> online campaigns where as I said we're owning my midlife queen age that I talk about so much.
(47:31) So I'd love to see more of that shift happening >> that will encourage because representation >> matters. Representation matters a lot. >> I just want to ask about HR. I had one question or two questions on that which is uh >> you know one of the things I heard is that a lot of women feel that when they hear about HRT they think it'll make them look like a man or something.
(47:48) You may have heard that as well. >> Um what should a woman do if she wants help but is scared of hormones because you know she has some misconception about >> hormones with with cancer or with >> you know changing her femininity or something like that. Yeah, >> that's a little bit of a challenging one.
(48:07) You know, uh changing mindset is a big deal. Um correcting misinformation is a little bit easier. You'll see even on a casual research, it will show you that HRT is as like will not turn you into a man. I am, by the way, on testosterone as one of my um as one of my hormone um um as one of my HRTs >> replacements, right? >> Hormone replacements.
(48:32) And uh I don't think I look like a man. >> I mean, sometimes I get the occasional little chin hair, but that's also hormonal. >> They say that if you see a woman in her 50s doing this, >> yeah, >> she's not actually thinking. She's checking for chin hairs. >> Right. I like that. >> And it's okay. I own that. But if anything, I actually feel like I'm at the height of my femininity right now because I own it. And I'll tell you why.
(48:58) I'll tell you why this is really important. For a young woman, we define our femininity and our attractiveness through the lens of how men see us. >> Yes. >> At this stage, this is how I see myself, >> right? >> Very very big powerful shift. >> The male gaze versus your own gaze >> versus your own gaze that I want to emphasize and I want to share that message with women.
(49:22) Um again to to to completely let's correct the narrative. Let's redirect the narrative on midlife that it isn't this loss necessarily. I mean having said that let me say one thing that I think >> I think it's important to acknowledge that there might be a period of grief for the woman you were >> and then a little bit of kind of sense of um fear for the woman you're going to become. Mhm.
(49:52) >> I I think I went through a period of grief. Yeah, I did. I did. If I if I have to be completely honest with myself for the woman that I was because remember I was a woman who was my public persona and my identity was so built on how I looked and being this object of >> of seduction and this object of like a sex symbol that basically you know >> and I certainly moved beyond that in my own head quickly which I think saved me >> but at the same time you still have to grieve what came Yes, there's been a loss >> and that's okay.
(50:29) >> And that was your identity. No matter how much you tried >> for it not to be or whatever, it was your I mean it's there. All these things affect us. You know, we don't realize it. But >> they're all inside us. There's different versions of me. And believe me, here's the cool thing about 54.
(50:42) If you call me sexy today, I'll say, "Yeah, hell yeah, I am. I own it in a very different way >> because again, I don't feel it through the male gaze. I feel like I feel sexy. I feel sexy. I'm not sexy because I did not when I was young. I started when I was 16. What the hell did I know about anything in the world, you know? >> Yeah. Yeah. 16. That's crazy.
(51:02) I just want to talk a little bit about, you know, you said something very interesting, which is that menopause is not does not only affect the woman, but it affects her whole family, her partner, it's everyone because of the change that's happening. >> Um, >> so can you tell us a little bit more about what should the partner do or how should the woman deal with this? you know what conversation should she have once she realizes what's happening she's spoken to a doctor and she's like okay this this is happening I'm going through
(51:27) this transition >> what should you do then >> I think this is going to be like one of the most important you know topics of this conversation at least it's one that a lot of women feel very strongly about >> is getting that support >> okay now you know what's happening now what okay how do you bring your husband husband onto the menopause train or the permenopause train, right? And it's a train and it's a fastmoving train.
(51:56) >> Um, >> so that I have heard so many women who are like literally despairing like I just need him to understand. I need him to know that his presence is not enough. I need him to support me because I don't have the same amount of energy. >> But I think for a man it starts number one by listening. Number two, these are sort of interconnected.
(52:23) By not trying to fix it, >> okay? Like I know from my husband that the very first impulse >> when you see your wife going through something, it's like, "Let me fix it. How do I fix this? How do we solve this?" And >> it's a very common men thing. It's a male thing. The woman thing and the men say, "Just just fix it. Fix it." And she's like, >> "You're not hearing me.
(52:42) >> You're not hearing. >> No, no, I am hearing you. That's why I want to fix it." Yeah. >> No, you're not hearing me. Exactly. So I think and also to understand it's not easily fixable. >> It's not like uh like >> it's not like take a pill even even if you start on HRT it's not like instantly everything is fixed.
(52:58) >> No, it's 10 years maybe. >> It could be 10 years of dealing with this. So I think that that's really important for men to understand from my point of view. >> Um you know what would be cool? I mean a man to come along on the appointment to understand to understand what's going on. It's her biology. >> When she's snapping at you and biting your head off, >> it's not her.
(53:22) >> It's her biology. And I get it. I actually get it. It's hard for men. >> You know, the woman you love and who's been your partner and you know, you've been through so much together. Suddenly, she's different. >> She's not the same person. >> It's her biology. So rather than sort of trying to figure out how to fix it or a blame game or you know not being present maybe like just shutting it out that's those are maybe the three worst things that you can do let's face it.
(53:50) >> Um just understand and if she has something to say if she has information to share um about an appointment or what she's feeling at that time. You've got to be patient. You've got to switch off that one impulse of like let me just fix it and move on. like the fix it and move on is honestly for me the worst thing you could do in this situation.
(54:11) I know it's not easy, >> but you both have to partner on this. You have to and I'd love to have more men involved in these conversations you know like we do a lot of um events myself and you her and we've gone everywhere from Goa to Hyderabad >> to Amritser to you know Bombay and uh these rooms are great >> right >> these are great and we try to create safe spaces again like women's type circles >> yeah men and women >> we invite anyone who has a question anyone who wants to come >> right and we have our doctors there to,
(54:46) you know, as the medical piece of it and then I'm there and we invite whatever is on your mind. I would love to see more men in those rooms, right? >> Because they need to know. >> Like I'll tell you an interesting anecdote. So my husband has heard me obviously talking about this for a while now and he was at an event we had in Goa and he was in the back of the room and I said, "Listen, you're one of the few men in this room.
(55:11) I'm going to have to like pull you out as an example. you don't have to answer a question. He's like, yeah, yeah, that's fine. >> So, I asked him at the end of the talk, what did you learn? >> And he said, you know, said, you know, I've heard you talking about this for so long, but it wasn't until today >> that it I just realized that pmenopause lasts for 10 years and menopause is a single day.
(55:32) >> Like, I just I just realized that today the penny dropped in my head. >> And you know, and he went on to say that there's so many different ways that women experience that. There's not a singular way. He says, "Somehow I also thought that everyone >> experiences the same thing that it's the brain fog, it's the rage, it's the hot flashes.
(55:51) " >> And he's been hearing me talk about this for a while, you know, and I'm certainly not fingerpointing. He's very supportive. He's an ally. >> Well, that's a very common thing. I know in relationships where it's like you're like the the woman will say, "I've been talking about this 5,000 times." And the guy be like, "I just figured it out right now.
(56:10) " And it's like, "What the hell? So maybe that's a message for the ladies to be a little bit patient, >> but also I have heard I mean here's uh something that I have heard a lot. And so they say, I need my husband to understand. I'm just not exactly the same. >> I need him to be patient. I need him to help around the house. >> Yeah. >> I need him to >> pick up the load.
(56:34) >> Pick up the load. Pick up half of the load. I just can't manage. I'm struggling. And that doesn't mean just being present, you know. It means like helping around the house, doing some work or taking some of the responsibility for running the house, whatever it is. I need him to do that. >> How often do you think couples mistake pmenopause or menopause for a relationship crisis? >> Oh my god.
(56:57) You know, I think that we don't have enough research on it. >> Certainly not in India. But there are doing researches and studies on this in America and it's shocking. It must be like all the time almost like >> so they say that often you know we we talk about like midlife crisis and there's I mean this is like a crucial point I think midlife like late 40s 50s when a lot of marriages go through a lot of changes and a lot of marriages end >> and we're starting to see it through the lens of women's hormonal health and per menopause and we're starting to connect
(57:30) the dots and I think that um there are people and there studies where we're saying that Like per menopause is the reason for a lot of these. >> I'm sure cuz the woman is like I'm not myself and I'm not going to take any any compared to what I did before. And the man is like >> but who is this person? >> Exactly.
(57:49) >> And do I want to change and have this this new new kind of person and that's the end of >> and that's when the man goes through the midlife crisis and marries someone who's 20, >> right? >> Who tries to like recreate because he's found again a woman who's not standing up to him. Um menopause one of the symptoms is also it affects the sex drive of a woman.
(58:07) >> Yeah of course. >> So how how do you think a couple should deal with that and not how men not see it as a rejection? >> That's >> because I think that's a big problem as well. >> Exactly. Libido is really really important. It's a super important discussion. Um and and of course uh uh there's a there's another discussion around taking like topical estrogen or vaginal estrogen that can improve things a lot.
(58:32) >> But um again women don't know enough to ask for that and sometimes the doctors won't recommend that. That's again when I say choices and options that should be on the table for women, >> but it requires an open discussion with your husband of like this is what's going on inside me now. >> It's not voluntary.
(58:53) This is not me rejecting you. >> This is again my body. It's my biology. It's going through a transition. >> And again, this is not permanent. >> You know, my libido can come back. My libido can be worked on. But we need to work on it also together. If you're in a partnership and you know you have a healthy sex life, you have to work on it together.
(59:14) >> Yeah. Um what about children? Do children uh need to understand what their mother is going through? >> I think 100%. Look, I mean, maybe I'm not a typical profile of a woman because because I went through uh my menopause so early >> and I had children late, >> but typically women of my age will have older children >> who are adolescents going through their the the mirror image of menopause, right? We're going through adolescence that I've heard a lot about >> their crazy time.
(59:49) They're they're going through their hormonal crazy time and then the mother is going through pmenopause, her hor or or menopause, you know, her hormonal crazy time. >> I mean, it's a recipe for disaster. >> They're both snapping at each other. They're both like, you know, as I said, going, you know, mama's going through pmenopause.
(1:00:08) Mama needs some space sometimes. Mama's going to feel angry. I'm not angry at you. >> I'm angry because of the changes in my body. It's making me behave this way. You know to have those kinds of like simple conversations can actually like revolutionize the relationship in the house rather than >> give them a reason otherwise it's like why is she getting angry with me >> cuz the kid will think that.
(1:00:29) >> Yeah. Yeah. >> But it's not that it's just something going through. Yeah. >> You know and we need to like keep and on top of that if you have daughters it's so important and you're preparing them for what comes next you know like down the line. >> And and what about a little more on husbands? Uh cuz very often like you said when there's an argument even if the husband understands or the spouse understands everything he'll say oh it's just your hormones it's your hormones.
(1:00:52) >> What do you feel I'm curious like what do you feel is the right now the best solution between >> husband and wife? Yeah. What what can a man do? >> I mean on on the deepest level of course it is a space for the the man to reflect as well actually like what does this mean? What does this person sitting across him mean to him? If I I I asked myself that when you were talking about I was thinking about that anyway.
(1:01:18) >> Yeah. >> That yes, I've understood now the enormity of the situation and it's a like a long it's it's a situation. It's a whole situation with a bunch of things going on. Libido not anger blah blah blah blah. >> So it's like first question would be where do I where do I see myself in this life with this person? You really have to be clear on that I think. Yeah.
(1:01:38) >> Otherwise, you're going to be, you know, passive or resentful or all these stupid things or you'll have avoidance and all. You need, >> you know, before anything your thought has to be, I believe your thought has to be very, very clear going in. >> If you have dissonance in your head, then it just comes out in all these different ways.
(1:01:54) You'll have 100 strategies. >> It'll get amplified. >> Yeah. I don't want to talk to you about it. I'm going to shut 5,000 things that you can do to not get into it really. Or you can pretend also. You can pretend to be >> It's not happening. >> Yeah. Yeah. Like, no. But you mean to some shitty level that your wife will catch out in one second that oh uh >> you know I care I'm listening I'm listening but you're not really giving a flying f you know.
(1:02:15) So I think that's the first thing that you have to do. You really have to reflect on >> what does love mean or something like that? You know what what does it mean to be with this person? Do I love this person? >> What does relationship >> what does relationship mean? What does support mean? What does your husband wife or whatever relationship you're in mean? >> And that really has to be your north star in a way.
(1:02:35) But I think that's what it is really. >> That's powerful. No, no, no. That's really genuinely powerful. >> Um, I wish more spouses thought like you, you know. I mean, it's like we need a menopause revolution. >> Yeah. >> You know, we we we need we need a new like a new container for this or a new language, a new menopause language or midlife language.
(1:02:55) >> And look, the the biggest thing that threatens people is change. >> Let's face it, especially in domestic setups, right? Like everything's comfortable. Why do you want to change anything? But change is inevitable. >> Right. >> Right. Whether you like it or not, change will hit you at some point. Whether it's also your kids growing up and you know moving on and or whatever it is or taking their own decisions and then your wife changing, a husband changing like we like this is this is the fear factor around this. But I think
(1:03:26) that we're set up biologically that the change has to be embraced in some way or the other, >> right? like you just have to do it. And I think but still I think also the first uh the first step for a lot of men is just awareness. They don't even know what's going on in their wife's body. >> And so that's why women are gas lit especially in family. She's mad.
(1:03:48) She's crazy. They didn't see their mothers go through this because their mother suppressed everything. >> So they don't also have an example. >> Yes, >> we are. I believe my generation, Gen X, the um so-called forgotten generation is the first one to be vocal about this. >> Nissa, you were once seen as one of the faces of beauty in India >> and now you're talking about menopausing menopause.
(1:04:10) Now you're talking about menopause, aging and health. >> Yeah. >> So, do you think that women are sold too much uh anti-aging stuff and too little healthcare? >> Oh my god. Yes. This is such an important conversation. Um there's a movement now which is called pro-aging, right? >> Because and it's the antithesis of anti-aging because anti-aging, what does that even mean? There's no such thing as anti-aging.
(1:04:36) It it leads to like unhealthy behaviors. Uh you know, the term itself is >> the term itself is problematic and toxic, right? >> Anti-aging what? Freeze time. And we've all seen those ads, freeze time, get rid of your wrinkles and stuff like that. >> I mean, I call on that, right? That's again creating fear around a natural process.
(1:04:56) Why shouldn't we love aging? Why shouldn't we love our aging face? Right. >> Um that in and of itself is very confrontational to a lot of women. Why? Only because of the the society we're living in today. >> So >> yeah, I mean again, yeah, because I've been associated with beauty brands. I've been the face of beauty brands.
(1:05:15) I was, you know, in the thick of it in my 20s. Um, I feel very strongly about it today. Did I um did I actually endorse those kinds of views, you know, by being a model in the '9s? Of course I did, you know, but I was a young girl and I was, you know, being used as it were. Um, so I absolutely owned that.
(1:05:40) I was part of the industry and you know the movement that created fear um in in women in order to help them buy more beauty products. Absolutely. But then this is me now today taking back my voice, taking back my power and embracing who I am, you know, as truthfully as I can. Am I wearing makeup today? Yeah, absolutely.
(1:06:02) But I own my wrinkles. I own my face at 54. I'm proud of who I am at 54. I think I look fabulous. Not I look good for my age. That's a problematic very very very problematic um phrase. You look good for your age because what does that imply somehow that when you're aging you don't look good? >> We've got to change that.
(1:06:22) So there's a lot of problematic phrases and thinking around aging >> that I'd like to be able to challenge one day. I'd like to be able to stop um dying my hair and go gray. I'm completely gray and white and I hate having to go to the salon all the time. It takes up my time and energy and it's you know >> why don't you do it? >> I don't know.
(1:06:43) I think that well first of all because to properly have the hair grow in it's it's a bit of a process you know just sort of stop growing because I tried during co it was not cute. There's a little bit of resistance inside. Yes. And sometimes it's from outside people. No no don't stop. Don't go gray. Then you'll really look old. >> You'll really look old.
(1:07:00) >> Right. But I'm ready to I'm ready to take that step. I will be ready to take that step. So, I do feel that at this stage of my life, I want to present an authentic face of myself, but also present one version because I think here's the other thing. We have to stop judging women's choices, right? >> You want to do Botox, do Botox.
(1:07:22) You don't want to do Botox, don't do Botox. Uh, you want to dye your hair, dye your hair. You don't want to dye your hair. The point is, women are still judged constantly on every single decision you make. And this is such a liberating part of my life being 54, being a midlife or a queener and everything like that that I just feel a sense of I don't know I feel a mission in just continuously putting myself out there even on the days when I feel bloated and not so good and and everything like that because this is still genuinely the best
(1:07:56) phase of my life that I have ever experienced to date. And I want to put that message out there. And I want to also say that of course as women we're so much more than what we look like. I'm so much more than what we look like than what I look like. Even though for so many years I was labeled only as a face.
(1:08:13) >> So I have a face and this face has something to say and I'm putting it out there. >> That's true. What is a face? It's just your skin. When you go into it it's your like in my tell you you know it's like if you peel off your skin it's just everybody's the same. It's like quite a horrific looking bunch of muscles.
(1:08:28) >> Yeah. We're all just a bag of bones and flesh, right? >> At the end of the day, that's what the Buddhists say. So, >> what is a queenager? >> Oh, a queener. Yes. I'm taking back this phase. You know, teenagers, right? So, since midlifeing, menopause is the mirror image of going through adolescence.
(1:08:49) You know, this term I came across myself and Sajaba came across it actually like step into your teenager era, right? Sometimes we need that imagery or we need that one word. Yeah. >> To like help because otherwise they're all very blah terms like midlifeer and blah. Okay. Menopause is a very charged word, right? >> What is the secret sauce to making menopause a supported, powerful, and even freeing transition for women? >> I think a couple of things.
(1:09:20) Education on what's going on in your body. I think we have to change the storyline and the narrative around midlife and what's possible for a woman in midlife and beyond. How this can represent your power stage, your queener stage. I think that these these sort of discussions sitting here and discussing this has been really powerful and thank you for it >> because you know we need to get this information out to as many women as possible across many different strata.
(1:09:48) you know, unfortunately my Hindi is isn't great, but I'd love to be able to take that story forward. It's not just about me. It's about, you know, this grassroots effect or this ripple effect through society. The more we talk about it, as irritating as it might be to some people, >> you know, it's it's kind of it's um you know, it's it's positive reinforcement that menopause is not the end, it's a beginning.
(1:10:13) Midlife is not the end, it's a beginning. The more we say that, people will start to believe it. Women will start to believe it and they will live that way as well. They will manifest it. >> Remember what you believe you manifest. If you believe it's if if if you believe it's an ending >> unfortunately becomes an ending.
(1:10:29) Women become frail or you start giving up. If you believe it's an opportunity into jumping into a new beginning and you defining your life the way that you want to, >> that's what it's going to become. >> For sure. Really fantastic. >> Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. >> Thank you.